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Q&A > General Tech Advice > Motor build, opinions please. > Community Forums > Mustang Forum Australia - Mustang Tech

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Motor build, opinions please. Reply to topic

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scott66stang
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boofhead wrote
The questions have been very good so the thread quality level is great for future reference. That is why a conclusion would be great as well - e.g. I am very happy - the motor build went well and she is putting out 300+ HP.

Scott - LOL. The solution to a good build is the 3pm Friday Topless Jelly wrestling, e.g, no work gets done at all while under the influence. (or should I say 'too much influence').

Well in that case when putting up step by step pics of the build , dont forget to include the Fri 3pm onwards ones aswell. Thumbs Up


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nassi
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scott66stang wrote
boofhead wrote
The questions have been very good so the thread quality level is great for future reference. That is why a conclusion would be great as well - e.g. I am very happy - the motor build went well and she is putting out 300+ HP.

Scott - LOL. The solution to a good build is the 3pm Friday Topless Jelly wrestling, e.g, no work gets done at all while under the influence. (or should I say 'too much influence').

Well in that case when putting up step by step pics of the build , dont forget to include the Fri 3pm onwards ones aswell. Thumbs Up


Actually..... I think Friday 3pm should be the start of the step by step and used as punctuation for the entire build...
Top idea Scott Very Happy


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trav68
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Next question.... Fuel Pump. By my research a basic holley 80 gph should be more than adequate correct? Any other recommendaton in brand/model?

Brand Holley
Manufacturer's Part Number 12-833
Part Type Fuel Pumps, Mechanical
Product Line Holley Mechanical Fuel Pumps
Summit Racing Part Number HLY-12-833
UPC 090127020333

Free Flow Rate 80 gph
Maximum Pressure (psi) 7.5 psi
Inlet Attachment Female threads
Inlet Size 1/4 in. NPT
Inlet Quantity One
Outlet Attachment Female threads
Outlet Size 1/4 in. NPT
Outlet Quantity One
Quantity Sold individually.


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boofhead
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Yes this pump would be more than adequate and it is a good brand. I have used Holley pumps with no issues. Not much more really to say - it has good flow and the correct pressure for a Carb.

The standard pump might just be fine - all depends on how you generally going to push the engine. Though your suggested pump will be able to supply fuel for all your sprints and cruising.

BTW: I am not a fan of putting the fuel filter on the pressure side of the pump.


I will someday think of something clever to say.

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trav68
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Engine block is back - 20thou bored/honed, decked with new cam bearings, welsh plugs and screw in oil gallery plugs
Crank micro polished
Rods have been fitted with ARP wavelock bolts and resized
Hypatec pistons installed on rods
Balanced with my new Fidanza flywheel and balancer (50 oz imbalance)

Price for all machine work and engine rebuild kit ( with gaskets, pistons, bearings, assembly lube etc etc) was $1700 from Harris Engines. Mark @ Harris Engines is great to deal with.

Whats are you tips for cleaning:
Chase all big end, head, intake threads etc and remove oil gallery plugs
Warm soapy water, rinse fresh water and dry quickly compressed air, lint free/tack rags
WD40 all machined surfaces - can I use this on big end journals where bearing shells will sit later?
Finish with engine oil all bores, lifter bores, cam bearings, etc

Crank and assembled rods/pistons - soapy water wash + WD40 as a above or just cans of brake/parts cleaner?
Re-install oil gallery plugs with thread sealer.

I was going to mask it up and paint prior to full assembly as painted gaskets and bolts don’t look right to me.

Cheers,
Trav


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boofhead
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This machine shop would have hot tanked it and cleaned it as far as your normal large surfaces are concerned. The warm soapy water is a good approach to make sure and do dry with compressed air. Then you can paint it. I would run either the appropriate bottom tap or even a old bolt with a slot hacksawed into it (along the bolt) and run into all of the bolt holes to make sure the threads are clean. I would also get some pipe cleaner brushes and run them into the oil galleries. Should find it is all clear because of the hot tank but if not then clean away. Lightly oil the cylinder bores and make sure the block, caps and big ends are very clean so the bearing shells will snap into place. I would not oil the surface just leave it nice and clean. Before each shell half goes in a quick wipe to make sure its clean of all dust etc just before snapping the bearing shell in place is what I do. You have it all under control. I suggest you get some plasti gauge so you can check the clearance on the crank and bearings are within specification.


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trav68
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Yeah I am going to borrow some plug taps and give all the threads a quick going over. Plastigauge and rest of bottom end package should be arriving monday from summit.

So just give crank and rods a going over with can of brake cleaner and check oil galleries?

Will plastigauge all crank and rod clearances and double check ring gaps (pre gapped ring set) and end float on crank/cam.

First I got to finish up my T5 rebuild and clean up the garage so only probably get around to cleaning and painting block this weekend.


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boofhead
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trav68 wrote

So just give crank and rods a going over with can of brake cleaner and check oil galleries?


That is all that is necessary. WD40 works well to make sure the machined surfaces do not rust. The priority is to make sure your oil galleries are clean.

You will install the cam first. Easy process just need to go slow so the cam lobes do not damage the bearings. Use long bolts in the end of the cam to help you guide the cam as you slowed move it into the engine. It pops in and off the bearings as you install it. Oil lobes if a roller cam or use cam breaking lube if a flat tappet. You can also get engine assembly lube which can be used in place of plain oil.

As you assembly the bottom end you will be using engine oil on all of the bearing surfaces (also clean and lightly oil the engine bore just before you install each piston).

trav68 wrote

Will plastigauge all crank and rod clearances and double check ring gaps (pre gapped ring set) and end float on crank/cam.


Yes.

I tend to only check the mains with plastiguage. I would check one big end for comfort though checking all of them is obviously fine. As you turn the crank to install the rods you will know if there is a big issue as it will lock up. That applies to the mains though you should know before hand due to the platiguage check step. There are tags on the bearing shells that make sure you get then in the right way around. They pop into place. Install all of them into the block and caps first. After you check the all the clearances then one last clean, then oil the surface of the bearing shell (only the crank side) and then install the crank (once again) install the caps and bolts and tighten it up. I work out to in with the main caps and torque in a stepped process evenly on both sides of the cap. I tend to rotate the crank a little after each cap is torqued up so if it is locked then I know which cap must have a spec of dirt. You need to lightly lube the rear main seal. After all cap are done then you check the end play.

Pistons - I put a the a top ring into each bore and check the gap with a feeler gauge. Use a piston the push it down 1/2 inch or so which will help align it correctly then check the gap. Care needs to be taken when you install the rings onto the pistons - you do not want to break one - it is probably one of the main nerve racking steps in my book. You can purchase a tool that helps expand the ring that makes this easier though it is not really needed to complete the job. Also make sure you have the rings the right way up.

When you pop the pistons into the bore make sure the ring gaps are spaced out apart from each level. I tend to use 1/3 rotation around the piston for each gap. Do use a piston ring compressor install tool to compress the rings make it easier (and less likely to again break a ring) to pop the piston into the bore. Oil the surface of the tool, set the ring gap positions and clamp the tool around the piston. Insert the piston making sure the skirt of the piston is well into the bore. I tend to wrap a cloth around the rod so it will not scratch the bore and I put rubber tubing over the rod bolts to it will not scratch the crank (even though the crank is turned so the stroke is at bottom to provide you room to work - though make sure the rod is centred to crank with spare space thought the covered rob bolts are over the crank (only just but this is necessary).

Make sure the compression tool is absolutely flat against the deck of the block - no gaps because you do not want a ring to pop out above the deck - no issue of it does you just need to pull the piston and start again. Use a wood block (I use the back of a hammer handle) and tap the piston down the tool and when you feel a small amount of resistance the ring is about to go into the bore. Double check that it has not popped out of the tool. If not give it a sharp but short hit and the ring should go into the bore. You will understand when you do this the first time. Keep going as above until the piston is all the way in. Pop in the bearings oil the surface the install on the crank doing the torque up in progressive steps evenly on each side of the rod. 7 more to go.

Hope this helps. It appears to me you know what your doing so sorry if the long messages are not required.


I will someday think of something clever to say.

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albanygt40
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All good advice, also make sure when you are putting your oil rings on the pistons that they don't overlap.


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trav68
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THanks to boofhead and others "we" now have some progress......

Some 7/16", 3/8" and 5/16" plug taps got every thread on the block chased. Even cleaned up the timing/water pump threads to be thorough



After I gave the block a thorough wash as previous post went over outside wtih wax and grease quite a few times and prep'ed for painting. Painting is within my knowledge base so made this bit easy atleast. Although I am not used to washing something then spraying WD40 and using engine oil prior to picking up the paint.




Block painted up ( bit hard to tell) with some VHT black. Going the black block with black and red Ford Racing colour theme I saw to good effect on another Stang.





And finally got my T5 all back together too to clear up my workbench. Just doing the final mainsahft end float checks here. One more shim and I am done.


Stay posted for the next step early in the week.


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trav68
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Boofhead,
Question - Supplier in US says trickflow heads with double springs ( 0.6" max lift version) are available earlier and his recommendation for my cam. He says he never really uses the TF single springs on anything. Should I hold off till the single spring versions are available or go the doubles?

Cheers,
Trav


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boofhead
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Go for the double - since they are ready and it would be better for you anyway. They are slightly heavier which will help with controlling float when you decided to ask it to go the extended rev range. Also allows the option to use 1.7 rollers rockers if you want to play in the future (though you would need to check Valve to Piston clearance [as always]).

Note: Too heavy and you just increase (potential) wear which in this case would be not be an issue.

BTW: Nice Pics.


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Shaunp
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On rings, if you have trouble putting them on, lip the end in the groove and run a feeler gauge around them between the ring & piston as you push the ring down, this lips them over the piston if you are worried.
Also make sure the 2nd ring has a bigger gap then the top one, even if you have to file it. You need more blow by on the 2nd ring, it has to be able to let gasses that get past the top ring to escape into the crank case. If you get too much gas pressure build up between the rings the rings can flutter at high RPM, and loose seal ie loose HP. I like to put the top gap away from the exhaust valve, not sure if it does anything but it's something my dad taught me to do, I take his word for it, as he built everything from lawn mowers, Offenhousers, etc to Ship engines.


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trav68
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I will probably do the main bearing clearances tonight after work. When doing the pre-assembly/plastigauge on main bearing caps is there a preferred/optimum order of installing plastigauge and torquing main caps?

For final assembly I will follow the manual with regards to order and the thrust bearing cap, seating thrust bearing procedure etc etc.

Cheers,
Trav


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boofhead
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No though following the manual will not hurt.


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