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Mustang Technical Discussion > Mustang Projects > Useful EFI conversion products > Community Forums > Mustang Forum Australia - Mustang Tech

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boofhead
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Good links and suggestions. There are some good products that would definitely help the install process. I did it the hard way with a separate swirl tank in the boot. A low pressure lift pump to feed it with a return back to the tank. From there the high pressure pump (external hence I like the idea of making the pump inside the swirl tank for both cooling and noise reasons) that feeds the EFI system with a return from the regulator in the engine bay back to the swirl pot. Works well though a fair effort to install.


I will someday think of something clever to say.

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lukep6470
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I would think the Edelbrock unit would only be good for a mild HO setup.

The 034 motorsports unit would be the best for high horsepower.

I spent a stupid amount of money on a self priming Weldon EFI pump to avoid running fuel lines inside the car.

I also ran a Corvette filter/regulator at the back of the car to avoid a return line and keep the fuel in the tank cool. This has caused it's own set of problems with head soak in the line to the motor. I've put a check valve at the back to try and help but that has yet to be tested.

According to my Megasquirt the ambient engine bay air temp gets up to round 50C in traffic with a standard 67 bonnet. I think I would've had a lot less hot start issues using the Edelbrock kit.


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boofhead
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I have found your approach and choices interesting because of the non-return setup. It is also interesting hearing your feedback on the consequences of the setup with the starting issues from the heat soak at the engine side. For a non daily driver (which your is) it could be a fair enough choice since you would be generally starting the car cold.


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lukep6470
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If you need to use a PWM speed controller for the fuel pump I found one of these puts out the same waveform as the $300 Weldon unit. I've used one for 12 months with no problems mounted in the boot:

www.ebay.com.au/itm/9-...43d5a57875


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boofhead
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Great find. Sure saves a few dollars.


I will someday think of something clever to say.

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66STNG
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Please excuse my dumbness but why can't you just run an external high pressure pump close to the tank? With a return line back to the filler neck. This is what I was going to do.
The engine is an efi 302 out of an xr8. I didn't,t want to cut up the tank, so this was what I was planning, or have I missed the point.......again Loopy


66 basket case

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Husky65
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You can if you like, as long you don't let the tank run too empty as you may have starvation issues when turning or going up/down hills. That's why most people will use an external sump with an external fuel pump.

The reason I am going intank is because of these reasons:

-I am building a daily and to this day haven't found an aftermarket pump that I can rely on to not shit itself after a few thousand km's..again, my experience.

-As it's a daily I want the pump to be quiet

-The intank solution will cool the pump, hopefully providing longevity to the unit.

-Not only is the ford unit easy replaceable and easy to get a hold of(and cheap), it's is tried and tested, and the fuel pump assembly comes with it's on mini
surge tank.

-It will be a neater finish


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hybrid
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66STNG wrote
Please excuse my dumbness but why can't you just run an external high pressure pump close to the tank? With a return line back to the filler neck. This is what I was going to do.
The engine is an efi 302 out of an xr8. I didn't,t want to cut up the tank, so this was what I was planning, or have I missed the point.......again Loopy

Are you talking about running a separate return line from front to rear, or running a pressure regulator at the rear of the car and returning the fuel at the rear?

Any time you have a single fuel line to the front of the car, you have the potential for the fuel to get quite hot in the fuel rails before it goes into the engine. Also, when you turn off the engine, you will get heat soak into the fuel before you start the engine again while it's warm.

Having a return line means that fuel is cycled back to the fuel tank and fresh fuel comes in.

A single line setup may not actually cause you a problem in the end. I'm sure many have done it.
However, my opinion is that it's not all that hard to buy some aluminium fuel line and run it along side the original fuel line, so I wouldn't consider the single line option personally.


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66STNG
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Hybrid,
There are 2 fuel lines, I pressure and 1 return, the same as your set up.
I'm just going to run an external fuel pump, near the tank. Just wanting to know the pros and cons.....


66 basket case

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hybrid
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Ok yes, you can do what you are talking about.
Some things to consider:

- As Husky mentioned, there is the chance that you will get surging when the fuel level is low and fuel runs away from the pickup when you go around corners, accelerate, brake etc. With EFI, this loss of fuel pressure means instant loss of power to the engine. With a carby, when this happens, it has the fuel bowls to keep it going.

- Generally, high pressure pumps do not have the ability to "pull" fuel upwards in the same way the low pressure pumps do. This should not be an issue if your high pressure pump is at a similar level to your fuel tank pickup.


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Shaunp
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66STNG wrote
Please excuse my dumbness but why can't you just run an external high pressure pump close to the tank? With a return line back to the filler neck. This is what I was going to do.
The engine is an efi 302 out of an xr8. I didn't,t want to cut up the tank, so this was what I was planning, or have I missed the point.......again Loopy


This is basically how Series 3 XJ6 Jags ran but the tank had kind of a sump in the large drain plugs.

XJS cars had a small swirl tank which was gravity fed


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boofhead
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One last thing to add is if you only have the high pressure pump direct to the Tank then if it runs dry it will over heat and die quickly as well as the engine leaning out with the associated potential of engine damage. On a street car - no real issue especially if you keep the tank fairly full and your not throwing it around long tight corners. In a track car you need to be setup like mine. That is insert a Small tank (swirl tank) use a lift pump to fill it with a return and then a high pressure pump (mine is external) to do the front with the return to the swirl tank. No starvation unless she runs out of fuel or a pump dies.


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66STNG
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I've heard the external pumps are very noisy, is this the case as a know the vn,vp commodores ran external pumps..


66 basket case

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ozbilt
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Mounting points of pumps in a couple of cars I have built over the years .....





Kerry

It is easier to get older than it it is to get wiser

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hybrid
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It depends where the pump is and what kind of pump it is.
The Bosch 044's are quite noisy, but not so bad if they're on the outside of the car. You can still hear them, but I wouldn't call it loud. You especially won't hear it when the engine is running.

Having said that, my BA setup can barely be heard, even when the engine is off.

The ones in Kerrys pics look to be Warlbro pumps. They are not nearly as noisy as the big bosch ones.


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